Raw Power CD 3: Interesting issues... and more!!!

cantona7 wrote:

mr datsun yes the 2 so called embassy tracks on cd3 sound like the standard versions to my ears, there may be some very slight eq differences but the mixes are just the same

Coming back to whether there really is a so-called Embassy mix of the LP, doesn't the fact the disc's 3 embassy tracks sound much the same as disc 1's standard mixes put paid to the idea of an embassy mix (apart from S&D) existing at all? If CBS can't provide evidence who can?

rubber legs wrote:

I have the 1973 US pressing and it DOES NOT have the alternate mix of S&D. I believe others have said that this is true of their copies too.

Well, jpstooges heard it and thinks it's the standard version but I just a/b'd it with my UK copy and the Legacy remaster and I would say that it is the alternative full version of S&D. The rip comes with labels and I'd be happy to furnish the links to a few people to check it.

(The rip has the channels reversed but I think that must be an accident in ripping. But please note that this is NOT my rip so I can say nothing about the channel switch or the rip in general but I have asked the original ripper and await a reply).

rubber,
If your copy of CBS US has the standard version then there really must be two versions of the US CBS label pressing but it'd be good for someone to confirm what my ears hear.

Really? The US album has always had the 'standard" mix of Search and Destroy. Even in the day in '73, fans like me were seeking out the 45 and alternate pressings (such as the Japanese) in hopes of finding a sound on that particular song that was not as thin.

Hey Mr. Datsun, after having checked out the version of S&D on the US vinyl I can certainly say it's not the same mix as the UK first press and Embassy first press versions. It seems to sound a little different, but I think it's either EQ or a badly pressed copy. Sorry.

Teddy, after mentioning the Japanese version, is there anything special about that version of the album?

No, actually. The single was the first acknowledged alternate to the standard album "Bowie mix". It's just that Japanese records sometimes had good pressings. The next we heard in the States about any variance was the Embassy mix, sometimes referred to as being "Dutch". At some point in the 70's, through all the various copies I bought, I picked up a UK Embassy that had the alternate Search and Destroy. The overall differences in the LP seemed minor though compared to the vast differences we'd been promised. In my opinion, the Legacy issue should have featured a good mastering of the "Bowie mix", as it does., with its superior low end to the original vinyl. It should have also included the "Embassy" Search and Destroy and not those other two tracks, where the variation was minimal. I do wish CD3 had collated the other major '72 outtakes -- Gimme Some Skin, Scene of the Crime, Tight Pants, Money and Louie Louie. They certainly would have fit artistically and it would have been a good commercial incentive to collect all the Raw Power era studio outtakes in one place. Robert Mathieu said they considered it. Don't know why they chose not to. This was the perfect opportunity. So while I'm generally pleased and think it's a great package, there's something to complain about (as uaual),

unheard78 wrote:

Hey Mr. Datsun, after having checked out the version of S&D on the US vinyl I can certainly say it's not the same mix as the UK first press and Embassy first press versions. It seems to sound a little different, but I think it's either EQ or a badly pressed copy. Sorry.

Teddy, after mentioning the Japanese version, is there anything special about that version of the album?

re. US CBS rip.

unheard78 (and everyone else). After beating my brains about how I was the only one who heard it as the alt S&D, I just realised that I had a UK CBS rip mixed up with the US CBS rip. I was comparing two different UK rips. The two rips were different enough to make me think it was a different pressing.

So yes, the US CBS rip that I have is the standard S&D but with a massively over eq'd bass (done in the hifi, I think)

Apologies for all the confusion I caused.

No biggie Mr. Datsun, your input is greatly appreciated and hey, we all make a misstep now and then.

mr.datsun wrote:

unheard78 wrote:

Hey Mr. Datsun, after having checked out the version of S&D on the US vinyl I can certainly say it's not the same mix as the UK first press and Embassy first press versions. It seems to sound a little different, but I think it's either EQ or a badly pressed copy. Sorry.

Teddy, after mentioning the Japanese version, is there anything special about that version of the album?

re. US CBS rip.

unheard78 (and everyone else). After beating my brains about how I was the only one who heard it as the alt S&D, I just realised that I had a UK CBS rip mixed up with the US CBS rip. I was comparing two different UK rips. The two rips were different enough to make me think it was a different pressing.

So yes, the US CBS rip that I have is the standard S&D but with a massively over eq'd bass (done in the hifi, I think)

Apologies for all the confusion I caused.

Jesus, how can anyone will be able to tell which labels are the one for the alternate S&D now ? LOL

In Robert Matheu's book Stooges The authorized and illustrated story, in the discography section talks a little bit about the embassy mix.For those who do not have this great book says this:

"UK cassette version of raw power was mistakenly issued with different mixes of 'raw power' and 'search and destroy'.In 1977,embassy,the uk budget imprint of CBS,inadvertanly issued this version on 12" vinyl with the band logo added to the cover."
I love this book...

I agree the book is great but no-one on this forum has yet to find any evidence that either the embassy UK press or the cassette have anything other than the different version of S and D. If there is different 'embassy' mix of Raw Power it has yet to be written about here.

if there's any difference is just as imperceptible as the mixes of shake appeal and death trip that appears on the 3 cd of the box.

unheard78 wrote:

By the way, I did a post about the multiple versions of Search and Destroy at my blog yesterday. If anyone wants to see it, my blog's address is: unheard78.blogspot.com

Cool! Thanks, man!

I wonder how often people like Bruce Dickinson do interviews about things of these sorts.I've tried quite a few times to get interviews with people from labels to little success. It's been easier to get friendly indie artists to talk with me but even that is hit and miss. But this guy isn't a performer, he's a studio guy, maybe I've got a chance. I'd wanna ask him to elaborate on some of these issues.

So is this guy the biggest idiot in the universe?

http://www.crawdaddy.com/index.php/2010/06/12/the-weakest-cut-raw-power/?utm_source=NL&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=100615

He discusses what he thinks is the weakest cut on the original Rap Power.

>So is this guy the biggest idiot in the universe?
Definitely. What an ass!

>weakest cut on the original Rap Power.
Rap Power? Yuk, doesn't sound good at all....

Oops, yes it should be RAW Power. Don't. Want. To. Think. About. Rap. Power. Possibilities.

nkdlunch wrote:

So is this guy the biggest idiot in the universe?

Probably but at least it sounds like he means it and enjoyed writing it. Also he doesn't churn out the usual 'most overlooked, most critically ignored LP in history' b*ll*cks that most hacks write.... A very entertaining and personal review that'll get a few people checking out the LP, no doubt.

It would be almost churlish to point out that Green's review fails to live up to the claim of the series' description – 'the least important, interesting, cohesive, or artistically integral song on a specific album will be singled out and discussed at length' . One paragraph? Oh well – clearly an excuse for some journalistic fun.