"Big Time Bum" & other oddities

Has "Big Time Bum" been discussed on this forum? It was mentioned being part of the Stooges' early 1970 repertoire, possibly being considered for FH. Anybody heard it?

The Stooges replaced album tunes one by one and I don't think they played much of the 1st album towards the end of 1969. That's why I think "Dog Food" could very well have been a short-lived set inclusion. It's not that all great a song, so I'm sure it was replaced by the FH tunes as they started appearing - assuming "DF" was ever played at this early stage. Iggy's not always that accurate w. facts... For example, James W. claims he did NOT write "Penetration" or anything resembling the riff of that song before London. He should remember that, but Iggy claims JW had the riff down much earlier.

Per

"Big Time Bum" along with "Fresh Rag" have been discussed on this forum before. Apparently "I Need You" off of the bad quality Starfighter bootleg is actually "Fresh Rag" and I wouldn't be suprised if "Big Time Bum" is on that bootleg to under a different name.

I doubt if "Dog Food" was played or made up in 1970 as it was based on a 1971/1972 blues documentary.

But talking of late 1969, early 1970 songs, what if (on the odd chance) more songs other than the "Loose" demo were recorded?

Here's a quote from Paul Trynka from another post -

I THINK way down in Egypt was essentially a jam, really a version of LA Blues, which they would do when the medication was right. There was a fan-sheet called Popped, written by Natalie Stoogeling, which listed all their set, around the time they were working on Big TIme Bum as a single. I recall it included I Gotta Right, You DOn't Want My Name, and Fresh Rag.

Again the whole late 70 / early 71 period seems to be quite a flux of band members and playlist.

I'm a little rusty, I thought "Big Time Bum" was from late 1969; it was later, being discussed as a single in late 1970 or so. I have the St. Charles (27 May 1971) recording in decent quality but it's totally impossible to hear (for me) any lyrics of the last 3 songs, one might have been "Big Time Bum" for all we know. However, I also feel the first 3 songs of the set are by far their strongest tunes at that time, "IGAR", "You Don't Want My Name" (a great variation on the C-F-G sequence, not too far removed from Reed's "Vicious" and many other tunes, but it actually has a melody that sticks - THAT would have been the obvious choice for a single), and "Fresh Rag"/"I Need You" (although Matt Gimmick's version is quite different). Those 3 songs are great and could very well have been constructed by Iggy, as they are essentially "sequences", rather than JW's "motifs" (opening of "Gimme Danger", "Penetration", "Open Up and Bleed", "Johanna" etc.). I think it's entirely possible that Iggy did do these tunes. JW would surely have remembered anything about them, but he didn't. The 3 last tunes of the Lake Charles (aka St. Louis which it wasn't) are a bit different, more similar to some FH mtrl. Need to listen to them again, though, to be able to say more.
Per

This is what I wrote about the Lake Charles gig for the intended Stooges back, several years ago. Per

This is, regrettably, the only circulating concert featuring the 1971 line-up of the Stooges, with Ron and James on guitars. Several of the titles are highly tentative, particularly those I’ve asterisked above. The words of the last songs are hard to hear due to the miserable sound quality. Regardless, it’s a fascinating recording.

“Fresh Rag” is often listed as “I Need You,” since that is the repeated phrase of the chorus. However, Iggy clearly sings “fresh rag” during the song. “You Don’t Want My Name” and “Fresh Rag” were covered by Matt Gimmick on his Detroit Renaissance ’79 EP. His versions have many differences from those performed here. For example, the “I need you” chorus phrase is lacking from Gimmick’s version. “Fresh Rag” and “You Don’t Want My Name” are both excellent high-energy rock numbers, being well-structured and catchy; they would have made great additions to the Stooges’ catalogue.

“Who Do You Love?” is a mid-tempo number with a vague resemblance to “I Need Somebody.” The tune takes shape around a stuttering guitar riff and it features an active bassline. Ron and James appear to be taking turns soloing on the song. “Who do you love?” is repeated as a chorus.

“See Me Dancing” is built around a fast bass-and-guitar riff, with a descending three-chord guitar sequence providing a chorus. “That’s What I Like” is somewhat similar, boasting a monotonously repetitious bass figure not too far removed from “Little Doll” or “1970.” Iggy’s vocal melody is also reminiscent of “1970.” Both “See Me Dancing” and “That’s What I Like” are riff-based, having more in common with Fun House (“TV Eye,” “1970,” and “Fun House”) than Raw Power. In contrast, “Fresh Rag” and “You Don’t Want My Name” rely on effective chord progressions much like many Raw Power tunes.

That sounds brilliant I wish yourh biography had been published. Have you tried again? I'd buy a copy.

Have you read "The Stooges: AJourney Through The Michigan Underworld"? Its facts are sketchy at best not to mention all the mislabelled photographs!

Have not read that book. Does it contain anything of interest, at all? I think it's hard to come up w. anything not already covered by Paul's book! Per

I've not yet read it but I understand it is about the Ashetons as much as Iggy so it should have more material on what they did other than being Stooges. That stuff wouldn't be in Paul's book. Is that right, G, F#, E?

Sort of but the only new Asheton incite you get is a bit about Destroy All Monsters which I already knew. Its in no way in depth.