Ron Asheton and James Williamson

Before anyone gets the wrong idea I don't mean to set this up as a sort of contest, but it's interesting to compare these two guitarists - they're so different! I guess Williamson is generally regarded as being more gifted technicially but Asheton gets a superior sound, which, for me, is the greater talent. Williamson's got plenty fire and energy too of course and I especially like his more blues-y stuff, like on 'I Need Somebody' and, even more, 'Pinpoint Eyes', which is just terrific. But a lot of the time - certainly on Raw Power - he sounds like a fairly conventional hard-rock guitarist, all thrash and trebly, spiky solos, whereas Asheton's playing is so much more fluid and so rhythmic. Overall, Asheton just has more of an impact - such an incredibly full sound. That's my opinion, and maybe I hold Asheton's guitar-playing in too much reverence, but also I chanced to hear Asheton's playing long before I ever heard Williamson's, so Asheton set the standard for me. Williamson is still a great player of course (or was!!!) but I prefer Asheton because he just sounds so unique.
any thoughts?

i think williamson have a Powerfull song. you can see his job on raw power, like a pounch. never see something like that. i like his style a lot. so far from that time.

"he sounds like a fairly conventional hard-rock guitarist"

i like ron asheton too and i prefer him over williamson as a guitarist (though i want to play like williamson), btu i think you may have to listen to raw power again!

The reason Raw Power is Raw Power is cause (as is all stooges music) it sounds nothing like anything before or after it, williamsons force is his sound, and its somethin even trying disciples cant match, asheton is a tremendous guitarist also, and is more poetic, as iggy puts it, but williamson is just as good, and as you said, you cant compare them

hsjw, it's interesting that you prefer ron asheton as a guitarist but want to play like williamson

Nadja wrote:

hsjw, it's interesting that you prefer ron asheton as a guitarist but want to play like williamson

Aye, well i dunno, i suppose its not that weird, do you play guitar urself? i think it takes a guitarists head to appreciate the difference, i think it also stems from my love of the stones, i wanna play like richards, and i want that deathtrippy edge that the stooges have, hence williamson

I'm more of a Ron fan, but I also appreciate what James did for the band too.

homesickjameswilliamson wrote:

Nadja wrote:

hsjw, it's interesting that you prefer ron asheton as a guitarist but want to play like williamson

Aye, well i dunno, i suppose its not that weird, do you play guitar urself? i think it takes a guitarists head to appreciate the difference, i think it also stems from my love of the stones, i wanna play like richards, and i want that deathtrippy edge that the stooges have, hence williamson

surely that means you DO prefer williamson? anyway I don't play guitar, I can only worship from afar. I took violin lessons when I was very young and no one ever advised me to try guitar instead. I wish they had, cos then my whole life could've been magically different ...

I can see how you'd think that, but i personally would rather play like williamson, but i prefer to listen to ron, i love the way he plays, tho i wouldnt like to play like that (well i do, but williamson's richards' style is more accessible)

do you kinda mean that's it's pretty near impossible to copy Ron? sorry to drag this out, but as a non-guitarist myself I'd really be interested to know, because I always get the feeling that Ron's playing is really unique (like I said at the beginning of this thread)

Yeh, its that uniqueness that i love, but wouldnt want to copy into my own style of music, and i dont think i could, its just a personal opinion, sorry if i dont seem to make sense but, i love the stooges, and ron's style specifically, but in the music i make i want to sound like williamson

Ron is more inventive in my opinion. However, both him and James are very original. You can hear the influences slightly, but they're obviously not copying. That's a key reason why they're both great!

StoogesMySpaceAdmin wrote:

Ron is more inventive in my opinion. However, both him and James are very original. You can hear the influences slightly, but they're obviously not copying. That's a key reason why they're both great!

exactly

I'm more of a Asheton fan simply because he had such a distinct groove to his playing. James Williamson's playing on Raw Power is def more punk than Asheton on Fun House, but Asheton had a better groove. However, both guitarists are on my "favorite guitarists of all time" list.

Overall, I prefer Asheton, but some of my favourite Stooges tracks are I Gotta Right, Sick of You, and Gimme Some Skin with Williamson.

Some people say that The Skull was more accomplished musician than Ron. Even if, both of them kick ass. Their playing influenced various guitarists and styles. That's the point

sheddy wrote:

Overall, I prefer Asheton, but some of my favourite Stooges tracks are I Gotta Right, Sick u and of You, an Gimme Some Skin with Williamson.

'Gimme some Skin' - great guitar work, 'Scene of the Crime' and 'Open up and Bleed' two of the best riffs ever, esp 'Bleed' - so compelling. And 'Pinpoint Eyes' - very expressive. Also great stuff by Williamson on the 'Raw Power' album of course
Having said all that, I still prefer Ron Asheton's guitar-playing to everything else.

Ron Asheton is a more basic three chord punk guitarist, but he on Funhouse did a great job on guitar and made his guitars really "scream like street whores" (1001 albums you must hear before you die).

james Williamson is really a punch guitar, a guy who explored every tone his Vox Ac30 and his Gibson Les Paul Custom could give him. He created a guitar never seen before, and wich was, alongside with Ron Asheton's guitar playing, a big influence on punk.

eusebioneto wrote:

Ron Asheton is a more basic three chord punk guitarist, but he on Funhouse did a great job on guitar and made his guitars really "scream like street whores" (1001 albums you must hear before you die).

james Williamson is really a punch guitar, a guy who explored every tone his Vox Ac30 and his Gibson Les Paul Custom could give him. He created a guitar never seen before, and wich was, alongside with Ron Asheton's guitar playing, a big influence on punk.

fuckin A', man

As I said at the beginning of this thread I didn't mean to set this up as a contest, but I have to admit that even after allowing Williamson, and every other guitarist in all of history, their due, I always come back to my absolutely unchangeable opinion that Ron created the greatest sound ever heard, not to mention the most incredible grooves. That's enough for me! (Okay, that's an opinion) And it's really because of his playing, far more than anything else, that I got so deeply into this whole Stooges thing, I'll admit that too. Maybe I'm a bit obsessive on this point, but I don't care. The whole point of a forum like this is to express your deepest feelings about music and stuff I guess! (otherwise what's the point)
There ... I've had my rant

Nadja wrote:

Ron created the greatest sound ever heard, not to mention the most incredible grooves

yeh, ron's my favourite stooges guitarist as well, though alot of the 'grooves' came from dave, they gotta a bass riff from him and worked around that, iggy wrote down on the street, ron wrote T.V. Eye. and Loose i think and dave came up with the bass/base riffs for dirt, funhouse and maybe 1970 i think, not too sure about that one

In my humble opinion, the best Stooges material is with Ron on guitar and Dave on bass. GROOVE is right on the money.

And of course, let's not forget this guy...
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Of course I love ALL Stooges music. But the Ron/Dave stuff to me is the best.

Yeh definitly, ron n dave ... and scott .... and iggy....lol, i love the orginal lineup so much

If there is any one JW version Stooges song that stands out to me though, it's gotta be "Sick Of You". Goddamn, that ice-pick guitar on that just floors me. That's by far my favorite Williamson-era song. Fuuuuuuccckkkkkk......

Oh yeh, thats a fuckin amazing song!!, i love that I Got a Right and Gimme Some Skin, those 3 could go head to head with any funhouse era stooges

homesickjameswilliamson wrote:

Nadja wrote:

Ron created the greatest sound ever heard, not to mention the most incredible grooves

yeh, ron's my favourite stooges guitarist as well, though alot of the 'grooves' came from dave, they gotta a bass riff from him and worked around that, iggy wrote down on the street, ron wrote T.V. Eye. and Loose i think and dave came up with the bass/base riffs for dirt, funhouse and maybe 1970 i think, not too sure about that one

yeah well Ron's ability to get into the groove first created by Dave is just incredible. But it's OK, I'm not going to start raving again about Ron, OR Dave (as I've done elsewhere) - I've had a lie-down in a dark room! But the 1970 riff - I'm not sure about who came up with that one either

and, Loose, rest assured that I fully appreciate Scott Asheton's contribution in all of this!